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(Tape B)

This is a continuation of the interview with Congressman Ed Koch.

Well, Costikyan was then county leader and very distressed at the thought that the DeSapio people and DeSapio would make a comeback. HE called me up to come up and see him. As I indicated, he was not beloved by the reformers. He had been elected as county leader by what they would consider to be a sort of a third force. He was the candidate of Wagner and Lehman and not of the major reform forces as they saw themselves. In any event, he said to me that he had taken a poll and the poll showed that I was going to lose by 1500 votes if I ran, as I was then running, as a reformer against an old-liner; and that the only way there was a chance of winning was if I ran on my record as a community leader. I had done a lot in the Village as a lawyer providing pro bono services and involved in many community matters. He recounts this story, as I'm giving it to you, in his book, Behind Closed Doors, which is his history of politics in the city. It happens to be a very favorable reporting of the incident, and it amazed me that he did it because he was very angry with me when his book came out because I had come out for Lindsay and he was Beame's campaign manager. Notwithstanding that, he had this incident in the book. He said, “Koch, instead