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but he may have been the grandfather. He was the owner of the City Investing Building, which was one of the big, new office buildings downtown. He was also the owner of other very considerable properties and he was very much real estate minded. What happened was that although he started out being opposed to all these things, he really became a convert. As time went on, as he sat on that commission, as he saw Smith and Wagner gradually becoming aware of these hazards and being converted, he became converted to the idea that something ought to be done. Although he was a kind of a sour character and really quite nasty in the things he would say, he got to the point so that when we came to the votings, he voted for, I should say, eighty per cent of the recommendations that were made. He voted no more often than other members of the commission did, but he was brought way around.

What he stuck on was the cost that was to be imposed upon low buildings that were old. That was purely a monetary matter. He was one of the people that Miss Dreier opened her big blue eyes at and said, “Why, Mr. Dowling!” He began quoting percentages - the extraordinary small percentage of the total population that lost its life in fires in factory buildings. “So many people in one year