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own schemes of who they should be loyal to. They were very clannish and loyal to each other. They overlooked many of each other's shortcomings. I don't pretend to justify what they did, but I think it would have been a good idea if some of the highfalutin up-state Democrats would have blended themselves with Tammany Hall during an earlier period and brought the whole group along into a higher level of operation. It was sufficient at that time to stay separate.

Smith always said little slurring things about “Red Mike” Hylan, but not publicly. He never said anything much. He just would shrug his shoulders and say, “Oh, well, let ‘Red Mike’ fume. We can't do anything with him.” His mind was on something else. Hylan was neglected by Smith, except that Smith certainly didn't ignore the fact that because of his post in the city he might have a great deal of influence with a great many votes. It was all perfect politeness there.

Hearst was against Smith in his first campaign for Governor, but it wasn't a wild fight against him like it was in '22. The campaign was based largely on what he had done as Assemblyman. Smith said we had to go on on a new basis. He had a great many ideas about a bolder approach to the state government and to clean up the state government. What it meant was that we had to run the Republicans out