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vague contacts with the Department of Labor in Washington. Old Mr. William B. Wilson was U. S. Secretary of Labor during Al Smith's first term. I came to Washington on one occasion, that I can't for the life of me remember. I went to call on him and paid my respects, which was all right. We had a very pleasant conversation and that was all there was. I was concerned with the Children's Bureau. I saw Grace Abbott who headed it. When she and other staff came to New York, I often saw them. The Women's Bureau, of course, we were in constant contact with because they had a lot of data that we needed with regard to the operation of laws regulating hours of labor and minimum wages of women in different states and in other countries. We were in very constant touch with them. Whenever we were proposing any legislation in that field, or thinking of revising our methods of procedure, we always saw people from the Women's Bureau, either by our people going down there, or more often they'd come up to us. They'd stay a day or two and we'd go over our problems. We'd get all their ideas, find out how some method had worked out, or how some other method had worked out in other states and countries. We had a great deal of help from the Women's Bureau because they gathered information everywhere.