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into it. A case would be made up, and the board would finally decide that Jones had been fired because of union activity, and he must be restored.

So if these half dozen men carried this on long enough, it was very disrupting. That was the kind of thing that was going on at Allis-Chalmers for a long time. It was as much as a year later that I came to the conviction, and in this the Navy convinced me better than our people did, although our conciliators were suspicious too, that it was sabotage. I became convinced from actual reports of Navy observers, intelligence people the Navy put in there, that we had real sabotage, people putting iron filings right into the bearings. That went on practically all through the war.

So labor trouble was always bad at Allis-Chalmers, and it was a very distressing thing so far as the war effort was concerned and so far as the defense effort previous to the war was concerned, because of the fact that they were manufacturing absolutely essential ammunition for the government. They made something that nobody else could do as well. It was a very essential operation that could not be delayed, but we had these continuous strikes.

During April of 1941 there was also talk in Cabinet meeting of some kind of civilian defense organization. La Guardia was making life miserable for the President all