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great deal of it. All the right to use a fiat or a proclamation about some economic matter can be given to the army to do provided it gets the agreement of certain economic forces that are represented by certain elements of the government. That's about all you have to do. There isn't much of anything else. You've got a Department of Education. You can gear them up a little bit to work more completely with the colleges and schools for hurry-up training, for finishing up in three years what would ordinarily be a four year course so that a man can get a degree before he goes in the army. All that kind of thing can be done. You don't have to have all this War Manpower Commission, particularly if you're going to have a War Production Board, or a center of giving out the orders and keeping the economy moving.”

I remember Wickard standing one day with me and opposing. I remember Henry Stimson saying that he wasn't keen for it, but that Patterson thought it was essential. I don't remember Ickes at all taking any part in this. I think Jones was on my side. He said, “We don't need it.” I remember his saying, “You'd better let people who know how to do something do it, and build onto what you've got, instead of making a new organization.”

There were other people who were not in the Cabinet who were pushing this program. The difference of opinion was very sharp. I don't know of any occasion where there was so much