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people in this country interested in the war to want to work at it. The truth is that there was quite a lot of apathy, and the apathy wasn't all among the isolationists and America Firsters. Perhaps it was self-interest, but it resulted in apathy. If you can call apathy an active state, it was an active state of not being concerned, not doing anything about it. That was really quite profound and penetrated deeply.

The young men of military age naturally didn't feel that way. They were the first touched, and they knew they were going to be touched. There was no apathy in that group, because they knew they were going to be drafted and dragged in by the hair if they didn't enlist. It was obvious to the young men of military age that they had to go through with it, and if they had to go through with it, certainly they wanted to do it as well as possible. They wanted to win. If they were going to be a soldier, then, by George, they didn't want to be an untrained soldier rolling around on a field, trying to handle guns they knew nothing about. They wanted knowledge of the techniques of war.

But the rest of the country was different. They were, of course, as reluctant as the young men were to go to war. But they were not stirred up. They were not alive. It wasn't a question of their wanting just bigger and better wages. We hadn't come to that point yet. We were still poor. We hadn't recovered from the depression yet. I