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influence with Lee Pressman than others did. He certainly was considerably alarmed about the automobile strike, Lewis was, and he did work very hard at it, and his influence was on the whole pretty strong and pretty good.

Of course, who can say what the President thought of him?

Before 1940, we had had a strike in which the President went on the air.

We had a strike every year, didn't we? One in '40-- no, there was in '41, '42, '43.

Yes, but by this time we were getting over into the war years. And we had the War Labor Board, and Lewis said, “What's the War Labor Board for, if it isn't to cope with me?” You know, he was very scornful of the War Labor Board. They almost ruined him by giving him all of the fringe benefits. They didn't do that to ruin him. They did that because they thought there was justice in it. It pretty nearly killed him, to have them give them to him, because he didn't want them. He wanted them for his talking points, and said so, to me: “Don't let them do this, it's very silly, very foolish, very stupid. How can they possibly reckon travel time? That's ridiculous.”

Portal-to-portal pay?

Portal-to-portal pay--travel time. “How can