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One of Paul's students at Columbia was Bernie [Bernard] Berelson, very bright young man who worked with Paul on Amsterdam Avenue. I knew him as just a bright young student -- very attractive, brash, and he maybe taught at Columbia for a time, but anyway, became head of the libraries school at the University of Chicago. But along about that period he was infected by the same virus, about having some kind of a center for cross-fertilization.

And Rowan [A.] Gaithers [Jr.] of the Ford Foundation met Berelson and hired him as the head of the behavioral research section in the Ford Foundation. And the Ford Foundation's offices were immediately next to me on Madison Avenue. And I got to know Rowan Gaither - - I think Paul knew him through some other connection, but we -- there was a lot of idea exchanges there, and Berelson played a role in formalizing a proposal to the Ford Foundation for a grant that later became the Center for Advanced Study.

And because Paul and I had been identified with it, Gaither, who knew Paul, came to see me and said that he couldn't -- Paul was not the person to run it, and he certainly wasn't.

Now, this was founded in the early fifties?

'52.

'52.

Rowan said, “We've done all the planning on this program that you and Paul have developed, and we'd like you to be chairman of the board.” I was up to here in television, had even forgotten about what he was talking about, and said I would look at the material and