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I met with him first when Jerry Wiesener organized a group of scientists for Johnson, and took some of us down to the White House to meet with the President, and told him what we were doing. I'll never forget. There were a number of Nobel Prize winners in the group. Mr. Johnson said--it's kind of corny--that he didn't realize that he, a person from--he named the college in Texas from which he graduated--would ever be in a situation where such distinguished scientists would come in support of him. That was the first time I met him. The next time I didn't meet him directly, but he got me involved in the Elementary and Secondary Education Act. I was teaching up at Harvard at the time. I got this call from the President's representative, who wanted me to come down to Washington--I think the next day or the day after. It was a hurry-up call. I went down and met with the head of his Council of Economic Advisors of all people, who had been given the responsibility of dealing with the economics and details of the Education Act. My only contribution to that was to add an evaluation component of the government's role in funding education. The third and last time I met was when a group of blacks who appointed by him--[Robert] Bob Weaver, Thurgood Marshall and a few others--gave a reception for him when he was leaving office. It was a very warm, friendly, honest expression of appreciation for his contribution. I went up to him and told him how much I personally appreciated his genuine concern with racial justice. He said something to the effect, “Look, it's long overdue.” He said to me, “I'd like to invite you to come down to visit with me in Texas.” I never did. I mean, obviously, the invitation was never followed up by a written thing. But he was