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had any special training. We saw poverty and went in to relieve it in all kinds of odd ways. It was the very height of the influence of Jane Adams and Lillian Wald, who were social workers and women both. To bring Miss Addams or Miss Wald to testify before a committee in the Assembly was to create a hush - Miss Wald was going to speak. Everybody came and listened. Miss Wald didn't know anything about fire prevention at all, but she was known as a person whose heart was always in the right place and was greatly respected because she loved, and worked among, the poor.

We used the Citizens' Union and the City Club all the time. Robert Binkerd of the City Club and Joseph Hammitt of the Citizens' Union, and their whole organizations helped us.

I really believe that every important civic and social work organization in the City of New York endorsed these programs. Therefore they released whatever executives they had to work for them. They would sign letters and petitions. I'm pretty sure that's the case. I know the Bar Association did. I remember a long afternoon before the Bar Association of the most intense cross-examination. Bernie Shientag and I went up together. He discussed the legal implications and I discussed the factual material.