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What did he want your role to be?

Well, he wanted me to come down and be with him.

In which kind of official capacity? With USIA? Or some other capacity?

He offered me, I'm embarrassed to tell you he offered me almost anything I wanted.

Well, maybe just for the sake of history you could tell me. [Laughs]

What?

Tell us, for the sake of history, what were the various positions?

He wanted to move Bob McNamara from Defense to HEW [Health, Education and Welfare]. In fact, I think he'd had discussions with Bob about it. He was talking with me about whether I thought it was a good idea, and out of the blue said: “You know, why don't you take HEW and I'll keep Bob at Defense.”

I said: “No, I'm not qualified for that.”

And with a lot of four--letter words he dismissed me on that score, and we went on talking. He came back to that--because he didn't move McNamara. He came back to it a couple of