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McIntyre didn't know them, and didn't care anything about them. McIntyre was strictly a political reporter and he didn't know about the people whom he called “do-gooders.” He didn't know about them. He didn't know the sheep from the goats in that field. So I often had to interpose to get really good people, who really ought to see the President, in to see him.

Hopkins and Hodson had battered against McIntrye's door for a whole day without seeing the President. That was one of the reasons that they came to me that night. I had to get them in to see the President, and I did. I went with them on one occasion and arranged for another interview on one occasion.

So the President had a very good idea of how it would work and what they would do. Also, he knew the two men. He said to me, “Which one shall I appoint? When I give out this announcement I want to name he man at the same time- make it all clear to people and say who he is.” So we discussed it.

Both of them had extremely good points. They were really extraordinary when you came to sum up what their good points of experience, and so forth, where. Hodson was in many ways the smoother operator, or at least it was so thought. Hopkins was the more dynamic person, at though he