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At any rate, we finally got to a situation where they said that I could tell Hillman, Lewis, and anybody else they chose, that they would meet them. They would talk with them, but they would not make a negotiation about the wages, hours, terms and conditions of work until the men were out of the factories. But at least they would talk with these leaders, and they would talk with them in Detroit. The unfortunate thing was that by this time many of the men in the shops were getting kind of suspicious of their own leaders. Those things come up during a strike. These men were now in the union. They didn't know the officers they'd elected. And, of course, this fellow Byrd whom they had elected was not a trustworthy an. They'd begun to find that out. He was very untrustworthy. It was very much of an improvised situation that they were dealing with. At any rate, we went home that night from this conversation, and I felt again, “Now we're on the right road.” I called Hillman and told him. He said that would be fine, that he and somebody else would go to Detroit, and on the day fixed they would go to this office. They would see whoever they were supposed to