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I protested against having Hillman and Hillman alone as a labor representative. I though the idea was crazy anyhow to have an industrialist and a labor man. He told us that day who he was going to appoint. He appointed both Knudsen and Hillman to the advisory commission. Hillman was there to represent labor. I protested that, saying, “Now, Mr. President, that's ridiculous (well, I probably didn't use the word ‘ridiculous’) because Hillman does not represent labor. They'll scream. He's the head of one very small union. That union is in the CIO. The AF of L is the old traditional organization and they not only don't like the CIO, but they don't like Hillman. They're going to kick. You're going to have great trouble. They are slightly more numerous than the CIO, and they are still the dominant stable force in the labor movement. You've got to deal with them. This is going to make trouble.”

“Oh, no, it won't at all. It'll be all right.”

I said it was a poor idea to have an industrialist and a labor man. I wouldn't have them on the Council of National Defense at all, but would get some other kind of people. He was determined to have that.

“Then,” I said, “put two labor men on.”